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Celtic Diary Thursday October 5: Same Old Feeling Every Time

I guess now we all know how Motherwell fans felt at the weekend.

 

 

I don’t want to say “that’s fucked it ” but the events in the latter stages of the 2-1 defeat at home to Lazio in the UCL means that there isn’t really anything else to say.

 

 

VAR, by definition, there to assist referees in case they make a clear and obvious error checks all the goals, well, most of them, scored in the UCL, something which makes football unique in that different rules are applied to the sport at different levels, decided that Dazen Maeda made contact during what we would normally call a fresh air swipe at the ball, which made Luis Palma offside when he scored.

 

 

Lazio then, predictably, took advantage of mental slackness in the Celtic team and scored a late winner.

 

 

My point about VAR is that it should be an aide for referees, and not an adjudicator.

 

 

If the referee thinks its a goal, or an offside, then that’s that.

 

If he’s not sure, or any of his assistants aren’t sure, then they…and he, and he alone, has a look at the footage.

 

 

I’ve thought of a name for that system…video assisted refereeing.

 

 

 

The match itself was yet another tale of so near so fucking many miles away.

 

 

The reaction of sme sections of the support has been embarassing.

 

 

We didn’t lose because we didn’t spend millions on a left back. Or any other player, for that matter.

 

 

The system, still in it’s infancy , should have recorded it’s first win last night.

 

 

Celtic played some good football, which wasn’t out of place at the highest level.

 

 

But there was one thing, for me, that was missing.

 

 

And it was missing in the Feyenoord game as well, though I am hoping it’s down to a lack of confidence rather than a lack of planning.

 

 

There was no one in either game to take the side and haul it over the line.

 

A McNeill, an Aitken or a Brown.

 

 

Whilst Calum McGregor can do that domestically, the time has come for him to do it at a higher level. When a team is there for the taking, we need someone who can decide at what point we take them, and inspire others to move in for the kill, to coin a phrase.

 

 

Some of you criticise the board for not investing, yet overlook the long term contracts given to last seasons key men.

 

 

That shows ambition, as no doubt had they not been secured we’d have been moaning about how we can never build a team.

 

 

Yes, we thought we were going somewhere last season, and yes, it looks like we’re starting all over again, but the key elements are there, and the policy of buying young and developing does work.

 

Those players have committed their development to Brendan Rodgers and the coaching team.

 

The disappointment this morning will take a while to shift, but there are little green shoots that when they take hold will be worth waiting for.

 

 

Probably.

 

 

 

I’ll leave the caption competition until tomorrow, because for some reason I don’t feel like laughing, and therefore, neither should you.

 

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the real Anton Rogan
7 months ago

Fuck!!

Fuckity Fuck

desdamoaner
7 months ago

Most of the critics I hear talk about not investing enough or too much weight on project players. No one’s complaining about the extensions.
More money, spent in the right areas and you maybe get players who don’t make mental errors.
We make those a lot, including domestically but often get away with it.
It’s not just about last night, I’m more than happy to excuse CCV his lapse, he’s barely played for months.
This year of all years we are in a position to bring in players like CCV / Jota who cost £6m ish but despite the league being wrapped up in April giving us in effect a 4 1/2 month window we couldn’t get even one of those deals done.
Or maybe it’s wouldn’t get those deals done.

Tam
7 months ago
Reply to  desdamoaner

100%. None of us are looking for the board to chuck 10s of millions in to a black hole but we can’t continue to miss genuine opportunities for improvement in our recruitment. All sorts of excuses are trotted out via the meeja and it doesn’t wash anymore. With these extensions there is the nucleus of a good squad, failure to build on that in January and in summer would be unforgivable.

Gringo
7 months ago
Reply to  Tam

They never have built on it and they never will.

Mind Lawwell bleating every single year how ‘January is a very difficult window to buy in’ when all he had to do was buy in the summer,.

Its not rocket science, ffs.

And he’s STILL at it yet, and so many fans, mates of mine included still trotting out the ‘Oh, we don’t want to go bust, look what happened to Rangers’, after Lawwell’s YEARS of moaning about how much Martin spent to get us to Seville and when it seems like every other major team in Europe are capable of buying fine enough quality winning players for their squads no matter the window.

Every major club bar Celtic, who thanks to this bullshit, can no longer even be considered a major European club,

Wait till you see the difference once Lawwel’s truly gone, if he’ll ever be gone, the toerag, he’ll still be acting as our de facto DOF as long as his boy’s still there and maybe even after that.

Big boss in a small pond but a pathetic fvckin minnow every single time in Europe.

Last edited 7 months ago by Gringo
Gringo
7 months ago
Reply to  desdamoaner

Spot on.

And apologies, I wrote my response before reading the comments,

highseastim
7 months ago

Yet another game that we don’t threaten with any corners we get, I keep banging on about it, but we must have the worst stats from corners in Scotland. Too much dithering on the ball, too slow in the build up(I was critical of this in the Ange era also)Scales and O’Riley apart there wasn’t much to enthuse over.

the real Anton Rogan
7 months ago
Reply to  highseastim

Not going to slate any of our players. I’m sure they did their best but people are blinded by the touchy feely story that is Scales. His passing was very poor last night.

Tim Buffy
7 months ago
Reply to  highseastim

19 corners in a recent match and we’d have been as well just handing the ball to the opposition. Shocking.

TicToc
7 months ago
Reply to  Tim Buffy

Exactly! We gain almost nothing FROM our corners and concede lots from the opposition’s. Consistently for donkey’s years.
Who’s supposed to be coaching THAT?
Big Joe needs a super-strong challenge and I’ve been on about this since the end of last season. He lost a silly goal against Feyenoord and did much the same against Lazio. I love the big mhan but he’s proving costly.
An organised ‘back office’ would have dealt with this in the Summer, but NAW.
FFS, what are these people paid for?

Funkyy
7 months ago
Reply to  highseastim

highseastim, I just posted and my main gripe was similar to a point you made. (it got the awaiting for approval sh1te so it’ll probably appear when we play Atletico). We pass the ball
back and forward and sideways like we’re trying to bore the oppostion, while they in turn hit a long pass for 3 of their attackers to run through us. I don’t know what the idea is..keeping the ball in your own half isn’t gonna win matches..quite the opposite when you lose the ball there.
We don’t want them to run about like headless chickens, but you’d think they had already learned that passing (p1ssing) about just outside your own area is a dodgy tactic.

TicToc
7 months ago
Reply to  Funkyy

I too have been on about that ‘own half’ shyte for too long now.
Utter stupidity.

Gringo
7 months ago
Reply to  highseastim

That’s been happening since Lennon, can’t take corners or free kicks and can’t defend set pieces.

Joke shop.

Tom
7 months ago

Ralph I generally enjoy etims articles however that one could have been written by Peter or Mark Lawwell.
You start by blaming the ref, then var, then Calum McGregor. Good god.
The problem is staring us in the face and has been for years, and we talk about it every season and no doubt will again this time next year.
I’m not having a go at any of the players, many of the new signings might turn out to be brilliant but they can’t be blooded at this level. We currently don’t have the quality, speed of thought, quickness of pass to compete at CL level. The good football we played was up to 30 yards out, the majority of possession was across the back line.
Had we invested in 2 maybe 3 players with experience at that level, we could be sitting with 6 points but possibly 25 or 30 million less in the bank.
That’s the difference. AMBITION.
Peter Lawwell has held Celtic back for years now and is possibly the worst thing that’s happened to Celtic in my 60 plus years as a supporter. The Kelly’s and Whites were bad but they never had the 60 thousand plus every fortnight, the mechanising deals and massive sales. A job any really good CEO would be expected to accomplish, without employing a manager in the shower or squandering many millions on projects that turn out to be duds.
The great Celtic support are the ones that are continually let down but incidentally they are the only ones that can change it.

Woof Charlie
7 months ago
Reply to  Tom

Aye the worst thing in 60 years. So 1963. I understand that a disappointing result can heighten emotions but looking like a shoe in in the league against liquidation 2, O’Reilly, Kyogo, CalMac, Maeda, Hatate, CCV…come on. Frankly I’m getting a bit arsed with the PL obsession on here.

Gringo
7 months ago
Reply to  Woof Charlie

If he’d just fvck off there wouldn’t be one.

TicToc
7 months ago
Reply to  Woof Charlie

“Frankly I’m getting a bit arsed with the PL obsession on here.”
Do you have a valid reason for that?
Lawwell’s cost us year in year out by depriving us of CL money with his parsimonious approach.
He’s a fukkin accountant who behaves like an accountant: knows the cost but not the value.
I suppose we don’t need a top ‘keeper?
Oh FFS…..have a wee think about it.

Gringo
7 months ago
Reply to  Tom

Nail on the head, Tom, great comment.

Incredible how many Tims still argue with these simple self evident insights into how the club is being run and by whom and for what reasons.

I can’t decide if they really don’t know or just don’t want to know.

HH

kenny
7 months ago
Reply to  Tom

absolute drivel

Mike Annis
7 months ago

You’re spit on in on thing. A lot of the Celtic support are embarrassing. The moans and criticism started and continued through the game and doubled down today. I thought Sevco fans were entitled. But we seem to be competing. But for a couple of decisions the score would have been reversed.

Damian Smyth
7 months ago
Reply to  Mike Annis

Mike Annis . You are spot on, I have felt like a loan voice harping on about groans & abuse from stands & social media experts tearing players or anything Celtic .
i honesty never thought the making one of most trophy winning , player , captain , manager permanently in shower or whatever needs to be discussed over 4 yrs later .
We don’t need to go over board to criticize., but please try to keep it modern & relevant

Gringo
7 months ago
Reply to  Damian Smyth

The board aren’t modern but they’re still relevant in how the club’s being run as a tidy little dividend scheme for them and is talked about by them in terms of a glorified savings account rather than a fitba club trying to improve itself year on year, particularly in Europe.

So board talk is more than relevant as it’s the same guys running the same M.O. while wholly underselling the support’s expectations in Europe.

Sancheto
7 months ago

Gutted as I thought we were pretty good considering we had a couple of below par performances (no names!) but we are completely amateurish/naive at managing games out! Tonight Lazio were happy to leave with a draw, just see it fecking out, 2 mins to go launch the ball into the opposition corners, stay in position/formation and they have to come through the whole team to score! Ok we would have not won but a draw would have been a fantastic result, the team would have gained confidence and experience as to what is needed to achieve a positive result! We have to learn to walk before we can run/win. Think of the confidence boost after getting something from that great performance! We would have been happy with 5 pts so what would have been wrong with 3 draws (or 5 from anywhere) and a win at home to Feyenoord, instead we have got nothing out of two pretty good team performances! Saturday’s game with Motherwell was exactly the same piss poor game management as going 0-1 up in 87 mins (?) we should have closed the game out and not needed 97min winner! I live in hope that BR, who has done a good job so far, gets some more experienced (better?) players who know the game and how to get a result! Mon the Hoops as winning the league this year is the most important thing for the club as next years ECL will be a game changer financially and hopefully then we will see some of the required investment in players to start thinking of L16!

Damian Smyth
7 months ago
Reply to  Sancheto

Celtic football club are built on the basics that we play to win . We had played 49 mins of 2nd half carrying game to Lazio trying to win the game the Celtic way . We almost did . Why change ? If we change for 2 mins why not go the h.ns way & thump the ball up in the air & hit everything that moves . But then we wouldn’t be Celtic , our culture & tradition would have died
Plese not

Sancheto
7 months ago
Reply to  Damian Smyth

Nobody is asking for us to park the bus or play anti football but there has to be a level of in game pragmatism/intelligence at specific times in the game. Yes we all want to win and play beautiful football but that unfortunately is not reality not now or in the past. We gave it a good go to try and win the game for +90mins but with minutes to go you cannot throw away all that good work for nothing! The draw would have closed the group up for at least 3 of the teams and meant that there is/was everything to play for in the remaining games. Ask the fans before the match and everyone would have “wanted” the win and 3pts ask them after and you may find that 1pt from a draw was a good result for the great work and effort put in by the team. I don’t think anyone would say that we didn’t try to play attacking football last?

BornCelt!
7 months ago

Millions in the bank, we are no going to win this years tournament regardless of the last two results, would like third and a run in the Europa, but anyhoo, hopefully a double and a better crack at it next year. Proud of the lads, they will learn and go forwards, three points Saturday will cheer up the Green and yes a son-of-a-gun midfielder who can play would be welcome. With Ange we would have won as the team was settled with him, but I feel next we will get over these hurdles with Brendon. Gutted? No. leave that state of mind to sevco. COYBIG!

the real Anton Rogan
7 months ago
Reply to  BornCelt!

The thing is, we don’t seem to learn

Damian Smyth
7 months ago
Reply to  BornCelt!

We never reached last night’s standard with Ange .
with Ange we wouldn’t have at least four of our better players , they couldn’t tolerate him ignoring them all week and not speaking to them individually

7 months ago
Reply to  Damian Smyth

In the words of a Mr McCoist of East Kilbride “we demand to know their names”

Cartvale88
7 months ago

A lack of planning, Lazio brought on Pedro last night, why? Because he is an athlete, no for his experience having played at this level all of his career. Yes we have projects, but we should bring in a couple of old heads that have played at this level for years, to improve the learning of the projects. Celtic were powder puff last night against an average Lazio, dress it up all you want with bad refereeing decisions, VAR, the Board, Calum or any other thing. But do the suits have the will to do well in Europe or is about trophies in Scotland?
You do not have to spend large amounts of cash to bring in an experienced player, look at Joe Hart, but we need an outfield general.

BroxburnBhoy
7 months ago

I thought we played well last night. We we good value for the win or draw and to lose it was cruel on the effort. Lazio are no mugs and we played some good football against them. The groans and moans from the stands put more pressure on the players. It doesn’t help. Just look at the basket of assets and their baying angry hoards. I’m gutted and encouraged at the same time. Atletico are are good side and also beatable. Feyenord should have beat them last night.

7 months ago

There’s no defence for that defence at the 1st goal.

Leicester couldn’t defend corners for the last year under Rodgers; has that been imported to Celtic?

Oh, for a latter-day Steve Walford to instill defensive discipline but lets not have a John Kennedy is/isn’t defensive coach circular argument.

Cater-Vickers twisted knickers is what you get with a half-fit centre-half but he was needed as his emergency cover is also a half-fit centre-half.

If results didn’t matter and mistakes aren’t learning opportunities but to be repeated then we’d all be happy and criticise those who foresee the glaring issues and that we have the means to correct them but never do.

All the contract extensions don’t improve the team one jot and with not being good enough last season and losing better players to be replaced with projects, its not exactly rocket science is it?

BroxburnBhoy
7 months ago
Reply to  The Cha

I think we as a group of fans over expect from our team. I look at all the results from around Europe and many very good sides shipped goals from corners, misunderstandings, free kicks as well as open play. Some of them lost and some won. Look at PSG for example. Candidly the last two European games have seen some very good football from Celtic and some major errors. The class of opposition in the CL is way above the SPL and we have raised our game. Not enough yet it seems by results but certainly enough to compete at the higher level. Hoping results will follow with experience

7 months ago
Reply to  BroxburnBhoy

Disagree to agree. 😉

We were playing the current 16th best team in Serie A, who have had an awful start to the season, not one of Europe’s elite.

I don’t think NOT signing an unfit CB to deal with a CB crisis is over-expectation.

3 of the 4 goals we’ve conceded so far have been due to defensive errors, which make it difficult/impossible to win games at this level.

Its not over-expectation to consider this very poor.

I do hope results improve but avoiding being an answer to a pointless challenge is the first task.

BJF
7 months ago

I rehearsed comments for the diary on my way from the ground last night. They were angry and bitter and eventually binned overnight. What Is wrong with our European performances? CCV made an uncharacteristic error, Kyogo scored an excellent game with O” Reilly and Maeda’s support. I believe we lack perhaps two exceptional and expensive additions to the squad. Most of our players are great, I hope Palma might be one of these exceptional signings , not sure about him yet.

Funkyy
7 months ago

Don’t agree with your VAR suggestion Ralph “if the referee thinks it’s a goal…” etc.
Scottish referees and Scottish VAR officials already operate their own rule definitions i.e. if it involves a Celtic player decide against them.
We can greet all we want, but Maeda did touch the ball on its way to Palma so the decision was correct under the rules.
My grip is that we should have been at Lazio’s throats after taking the lead, but I felt that they
looked more likely to score on more occasions than us. And ffs somebody tell them to stop passing the ball back and forward from goalkeeper to defender until finally one of them makes a mistake and puts us in the brown stuff. You could see the Lazio forwards edging closer to our defenders as they got rid of the hot potato that the ball had become. You just knew that one slip and Lazio would create a chance.
Lazio should have been reduced to 10 men for that deliberate forearm to Hatate’s face, but the Italians are expert at disguising sneaky stuff and they got away with it.
It’s not Mission Impossible yet, but unless we stop phaffing about with the ball in our own half we’re gonna get smacked.
After all that. I’m still trying to believe we can get something against Atletico, but it’s gonna be the hardest match I think.

Woof Charlie
7 months ago

What’s depressing me. Thinking this time next year we’ll be…(aye Del Boy) but this time next year some of our best will be gone and we’ll be rebuilding. Again. We are the Arnold Clarke of fitba.

Funkyy
7 months ago
Reply to  Woof Charlie

Woof, unfortunately the EPL riches are the promised land for “professional” footballers. Gone are the days when players loved their club and wanted to leave a mark in the history of said club. It’s ALL about the money now. The fans who attend matches or pay to watch on super dooper gold premium platinum channels are the source of that money and there’s no sign of that source ever being allowed to dry up. Ambition is given as the excuse by players who get
to the EPL or other rich club, but that “ambition” is only to fill their pockets while the going is good. F*ck you very much fans, but I’m off via my agent to fill my bank account and get a new
shiny sports car. They all think they’re superstars, they’re just super earners and now the Arabs are throwing money around like confetti there’s a new target for them to aim for…look at Jota, he couldnae get out of town quick enough when he got the chance of 10 million a year.
The years of loyalty and sportsmanship are long gone now. We’re like junkies, hooked on our love of our clubs and although we know it’s bad for us we just can’t get enough…ironic isn’t it?

Gringo
7 months ago

This system you claim is ‘in its infancy’ Ralph, is the very same system Peter Lawwell has been using at the club for the past 20 years …

Buy 4-8 prospects from the Up & Coming market for between 1-2 million and hope they find their feet in the next two year so we can then sell them for a profit then repeat the cycle.

Instead of spending just a wee bit more on 2 or 3 with quality European experience who might actually fancy sticking around to make Celtic great again.

In fact, I don’t even remember this EVER happening under Lawwell’s Moneyball system and if this system is any different from that after this summer’s buying I’d like someone to explain it, cheers.

Great article yesterday tae.

Apart from the bit about us maybe being tighter at the back but CCV should never have been brought on after his two lengthy lay offs.

Last edited 7 months ago by Gringo
portpower
7 months ago

sevco FC have redefined laughter.

TicToc
7 months ago

Another strange and at times inexplicable Diary.
I can’t be arzed to go into all of it but let’s see your assessment of VAR which is fukking nonsense:
“My point about VAR is that it should be an aide for referees, and not an adjudicator.”
To kinda quote Eric Morecambe, you got all the words right but not in the correct order.
It SHOULD read: My point about VAR is that it should be an adjudicator and not an aide for referees.
FFS what, otherwise, is the point in seeking accuracy via VAR?
Artificial Intelligence interpreting VAR footage in decision making would stop the ‘human error’, lead to accuracy and be fukkin quick too. FFS Ralph, get a grip!

Funkyy
7 months ago
Reply to  TicToc

Correct TicToc, it’s supposed to give clear concise decisions based on the Football rulebook
free of prejudice, favoritism, and er… honest mistakes.
The VAR decision on Lazio’s second goal was hard to take,but at least there’s no
suspicion of the VAR system being bent. If Lazio had scored that goal against us
and VAR disallowed it we’d all be singing it’s praises.
Today lifted my spirits as the new club had another one of their historically great results
against Aris Limassol…sounds like a brand of perfume not a football club ffs.

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