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Scottish Clubs Demand New Enquiry and Trophy Removal

One of our well placed moles informs us, and it should come as no surprise to any right thinking man, that a number of Scottish clubs held a frank and full exchange of views with the powers that be in the game, and have demanded that all trophies “won ” the now defunct Rangers during their creative accounting years are stripped from the records.

Thats all trophies, not just titles.

In the past , we have often referred to our moles as pish stained, as we did on twitter last night. so, for the avoidance of doubt, our source is not this man, as cruelly suggested on the social media network.

No. Our source is watertight.

The New York times , a serious newspaper, has effectively banned its reporters from using the word “source ” in any context, but what we also need to remember is that “sources ” don’t always want to be named, for fear of repercussions, and so you’ll just have to trust us on this one, because although, unlike the NYT, we are not a serious newspaper, we do like to tell it as it is.

It appears there was a lot of blood to be cleaned from the carpet after a number of clubs expressed heartfelt feelings about the now defunct Rangers and their triumphs in the years where they had a credit line with a bank, but not a direct line to HMRC.

In fact, there was a lot of bad blood in the room during the meeting as well.

Representatives of these clubs left the authorities in no doubt what they wanted to see.

Criticism, with the use of industrial language, was hurled at those responsible for the insipid Lord Nimmo Smith enquiry, and they want another , proper, enquiry set up immediately. After all, it’s now been confirmed by Law Lords that “sporting advantage ” was, in fact gained, making Nimmo smiths conclusions invalid.

And quite possibly, “influenced “.

Thats the first step. The clubs are determined to get their own way on this one. If they don’t, then some well known names will resign, and there is little doubt they will say why.

The other thing that has emerged from the meeting is that all trophies, not just titles, won by the Ibrox club, should be annulled from the records.

The clubs are determined to force this through.

Now that it’s been confirmed that cheating took place, they cannot be allowed to keep them.

If you cast your mind back to the time when the authorities attempted to shoe horn the new club into the top tier, and then the second tier, you will remember the determination of the clubs to prevent this from happening.

They are even more determined this time as at least four clubs, including, but not neccesarily primarily , Celtic, will not let this drop.

And that makes sense.

They’ve waited until they have a cast iron case, and are now making their feelings felt.

We should welcome and support this. All supporters of all clubs.

The media are going all out to prevent public opinion swaying toward the removal of trophies. Even, as one columnist today ventured, suggesting the removal of David Murrays knighthood.

When the laptop loyal turn on him in order to try to save the reputation of their club, then you know it’s almost game over.

Thats when , as much as we now know, they probably know a little more. But haven’t got the balls to say it out loud.

Finally, Scottish football is beginning the clean up after years of being associated with a toxic entity.

Better late than never, but it will be worth the wait.

 

 

 

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andybhoy
6 years ago

Brilliant Ralph. I’ve just managed to avert a similar embarrassing situation.
Wonder if his brogues are scotch guarded?

Whoriskey
6 years ago
Reply to  andybhoy

Hee, Hee.

jimbo
6 years ago
Reply to  Whoriskey

Pee,Pee

The Holy Poet
6 years ago

Maybe he actually just speaks through his dick!

holy sea
6 years ago

In the room ?
I thought the meeting was a conference call ?

6 years ago

If you want all the detail of to what extent LNS was influenced and how then go to the link in this post from KDS or contact me.

Whilst there is a LOT of reading if link works the document at link below provides all the detail on how SPL lawyers were not provided with key evidence and the consequences which should now form part of the considerations of SPFL clubs.

Recognised mainstream media have recently received the info in this form but so far no arguments the narrative is wrong. Others have had the key documents since last Sept but like SPL and SFA have not pursued.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6uWzxhblAt9aVdQMDVJdml2dzg/view?usp=sharing

Apologies for the length which is why it uses links to ease reading.

Whoriskey
6 years ago
Reply to  Auldheid

Great read, Auldheid, thanks for the link and the info. It is shockingly blatant and how they continue to get away with it is beyond comprehension.

Mike Bhoyle
6 years ago
Reply to  Auldheid

More power to you sir…
Hope you nail them
Hail hail.

ewanbhoy
6 years ago

ralph, do you know if its just stripping their titles or are they wanting the runners up to be credited with them too ?

Cautious Dave
6 years ago
Reply to  ewanbhoy

ewanbhoy,
I would steer well clear of the latter. Regardless of the natural justice I fear that the MSM could use this as propaganda as a Celtic v Rangers issue. If so you’d no doubt have a lot of non Celtic fans thinking what’s the point in taking titles from one half of the “ugly sisters” (as we’re commonly referred to by non Celtic/Rangers fans) and give it to the other half?
Sure we’d get fans of QoTS, Falkirk and others supporting re-awarding the trophies but Celtic would undoubtedly be the major benefactors in such a scenario.
The campaign has to be about punishment of those who cheated and nothing else in order to unite fans across Scotland.

John Daly
6 years ago
Reply to  Cautious Dave

Totally agree with that,just happy to see justice done. HAIL HAIL

Phaco
6 years ago
Reply to  Cautious Dave

Totally agree. Nothing to be gained from stolen goods. Just strip and move on to “hopefully at last” the level playing ground that we want and deserve as a sport. Nothing less. Hh

Charlie Saiz
6 years ago
Reply to  ewanbhoy

I don’t want anything tainted near us personally for that taint which belonged to them will then be levelled at our Club forever more.
Just put an Asterisk after each dodgy title and game they fielded an EBT player.
Then a wee note in Bold at the bottom reminding readers in yeas to come why that Asterisk exists.

Brencelt
6 years ago

Caption picture sums them huns up:
Tainted titles
Thieving taxes
Tainted trousers
Tribe of troublemakers

ewanbhoy
6 years ago

all this pish from the media about how 11 men on the pitch won it fair and square………no they didnt, their club cheated, broke the rules….end of………it may be hard on the players but tough shit, their club cheated.
every professional sport has rules and if any are broken, you get punished…….a golfer could play brilliant and beat the other players but if he doesnt mark his score card correctly then he is dis qualified……harsh ? maybe but rules are rules.

tykebhoy
6 years ago
Reply to  ewanbhoy

How many times were most/all the 11 on the pitch ebt recipients? How many of them were at least suspicious of the irregular payment method. Any that were were complicit in the cheating and not inccocent bystanders caught in the aftermath

jpm 88
6 years ago
Reply to  ewanbhoy

As the Law Lords pointed out , had it not been for illegal EBT’s, many of those ” 11 men” would likely have NOT been on the pitch in the first place ,that’s the whole fucking point .

Monti
6 years ago
Reply to  ewanbhoy

ewanbhoy,
Well said mate!

Charlie Saiz
6 years ago

He who laughs (and dances and sings) last will laugh(dance and sing) longest.
Fail Fail

Mike Bhoyle
6 years ago

I ran a very good amateur team back in the day..
We had to win our last game of the season,at home, by 4 clear goals to win the League.
We had already played this team at their ground and won 7-0..so we were quietly confident.
Problem was…They didn’t turn up.
We were awarded the points and a 3-0 scoreline…
We lost the league by a goal.
Cheating..?
Well we did hear that our missing opponents later received a new set of strips from a generous “benefactor.”
Anyway…Point is…
Rules are Rules..So apply them…or shut the game down for good. ‘Cos at the moment…its corrupt.

Charlie Saiz
6 years ago

I am going to keep my powder dry until the day it happens.
But I will let fucking rip when it does.
I am a patient man but by fuck I have waited so long time for this day to come.

beidh mo lá teacht

HH

Phaco
6 years ago
Reply to  Charlie Saiz

Charlie bhoy I feel your pain, rise above it. You cannot soar with eagles when surrounded by turkeys. The time has come. Hh

Southside
6 years ago

Was there a hint on Radio Scotland last night that a journalist may have been in receipt of an EBT? Or were the odd couple of Scottish football simply at the wind up?

John
6 years ago

I hope this is true, but I don’t have a lot of faith in the powers in control at Celtic Pk pushing this too hard. They have shown very little so far in making the SPL do the right thing concerning oldco. Hope I am wrong

derek
6 years ago
Reply to  John

from the downsizing at celtic park since 2012, i suspect the powers at celtic are desperate for some entity in govan in the top division. if that means accepting what happened in the past. then so be it. season tickets strangely went bacjk up to full price because it looked odds on that theyd make their debuts. prices better not go up next season, especially afterthe shit on the pitch this year.

derek
6 years ago

i sincerely hope this is true. but i also hope celtic arent instagating this. i hope its coming from the likes of hibs, aberdeen etc. if its us, then itll be portrayed as sour grapes and trying to bully people (or should i say ra peepil).

as for titles and trophies, im 100% in agreement that they should be remnoved, although i personally dont think they should be redistributed. strike those years from the records and move on. i dont think many of the players would genuinely want a 12 year old winners medal to arrive in the post. and the cups, well, it wouldnt just be the beaten finalists who have a right to ask for a medal, its all the teams they beat on the way.

jpm 88
6 years ago
Reply to  derek

I don’t get this “we don’t want the titles ” stuff.
It implies you don’t believe we , or others deserve them .

If we lost a title by 1 goal , or one point , to a team ” metaphorically speaking ” on steroids ; they’re caught out and stripped of titles (i.e. disqualified), then of coarse the team who “finished second” deserve the title .
It rectifies the error .
You can “part rectify ” , strip titles, OR , “fully rectify “,strip titles and award them to the RIGHTFUL winners.

jpm 88
6 years ago
Reply to  jpm 88

Also , despite what he may say publicly , I’m sure Chris Sutton would take great satisfaction , and feel fully vindicated , in receiving his 2003 winners medal .

6 years ago
Reply to  jpm 88

Titles stripped should go to the rightful second placed side who would have won the game had it been fairly played. BUT the point about giving the titles to the second placed side is not just one of fairness – its about educating society that these titles had been STOLEN in the first place and were now being handed back to their rightful owners – thus embarrassing the cheats at the same time.

jimbo
6 years ago
Reply to  jpm 88

But they are tainted
HH

Phaco
6 years ago
Reply to  jpm 88

The cheats played other clubs each season of the cheating years, whose to know what would happen on the level playing ground. Hh

Frank
6 years ago

Celtic should take part in these discussions but they should not be the ones at the forefront. It would just come across as sour grapes and antagonise a lot of football supporters not just Rangers fans. Yes I’d enjoy seeing them be stripped of the titles but I also don’t think we should accept them for ourselves. The titles would be tainted. Better to have the seasons in question declared void.

mike
6 years ago

Read today that SDM is in talks to help save the steelworkers jobs in Motherwell,I hope hes no going to a bank looking for a loan.Is he trying to salvage his ruined reputation or help pay back the taxman or is it the first of april? All titles including his should be obliterated along with the trophies.The newco should be forced to pay the fine and all costs GIRUT.

charlie
6 years ago

a cheats a cheat and cheats cheat every chnce they get so they should be wiped from scottish football history but i think when ibrox comes up for sale the celtic fans should buy it and keep it as a monument to bigotry and cheating aint life grand ha ha

Monti
6 years ago
Reply to  charlie

Charlie,
I like this idea, we could use it as one giant allotment, grow fresh fruit and vegetables by the ton loads, then give this fresh fruit and veg to the poorest and neediest families in our society.

HH

charlie
6 years ago
Reply to  Monti

monti when do we start

jimbo
6 years ago
Reply to  Monti

What about the asbestos?
HH

charlie
6 years ago
Reply to  jimbo

jimbo they are that fucking stupid we could sell them it to lag their house pipes

Phaco
6 years ago
Reply to  Monti

Brilliant. Hh

Charlie Saiz
6 years ago
Reply to  charlie

Buy it for a quid.
Level it
Plant tatties on it.

Oh the Irony.

andybhoy
6 years ago
Reply to  Charlie Saiz

Certainly not need any fertilizer.

6 years ago

Listen folks,sporting advantage is just a msm red herring.
Their contracts with the sfa where not registered correctly,that’s the nub.
They are fecked,titles have to go there is no other option.

Oh ma side’s!!!.

Damian Smyth
6 years ago

I don’t think the clubs should give the authorities permission to set up an enguiry . Any enguiry set up would have terms of reference arranged to prevent the truth coming out ,as Rangers old and new and the Scottish football authorities have the one guiding principle, and that is to have Rangers in ascendancy .
Far better to strip all title.and tropies won between 2001& 2010 and let whoever wants to appeal this decision and let’s see where any appeal takes them .
If we don’t take immediate action too many fans of fair and decent football will have died before decision is reached .

wulz
6 years ago

Really hope this comes true,if so will King still try and reverse the liquidation lol
HH

Monti
6 years ago
Reply to  wulz

Afternoon Wulz,
Nice to see you on, Bob the Hun Zombie is on my tail lol.

wulz
6 years ago
Reply to  Monti

Hi mate, aye bob seems to like getting his @rse kicked,typical ZOMBIE!
HH

schoosh71
6 years ago

The thing is they haven’t learnt anything. They have run up enormous debts to win the lower divisions and after their latest accounts they are at ‘death door’ once more. Sin-died is my solution especially if there is another insolvency event. HH

joe mccormack
6 years ago

Has anybody read JJ’s blog where he claims that not only did Ogilvie have a vote on King’s F&P status, he voted yes apparently, but he was also the conduit at the SFA for all the paperwork that was passed to the LNS enquiry.!

I find this hard to believe…………not even the SFA could be that stupid, after all we were told on numerous occasions that El President had removed himself from all deliberations Rangers lest conflictikn claims were made against him given his previous ties and er………the £96 k EBT reward.

Can’t be true, surely, next thing will be some rubbish about CO handling the 2011 Rangers Euro licence submission.

All will be revealed when the Craigster hits the play button on his tape recorder.

Monti
6 years ago

All titles and cups ‘ won ‘ during the EBT years MUST be reversed and awarded to the runner up, in the league and the cup finals of those particular seasons.
What about the prize money from those ‘ victories ‘?

UEFA should also be looking at the SFA and demanding the back the Champions league money received by Rangers (IL) from season 2011/2012.

Huns, they make me sick!

jimbo
6 years ago
Reply to  Monti

Any monies awarded to celtic should go to our charities.
HH

Mike Bhoyle
6 years ago

Keith @ 1:36pm…
Totally agree mate…the EBT’s “sporting advantage” are a smokescreen.
Its the “side-letters” and “undeclared contracts” that are the BIG issue( pardon the pun)…
The Rules are quite clear on this…
If you don’t comply…then you’re fecked.
All games where this applies will have the results reversed…and the Titles and Cups will revert to the “runners-up”.
That’s justice…pure and simple.

Charlie Saiz
6 years ago
Reply to  Mike Bhoyle

Sure the 3-0 defeat rule will be applied for each game where an EBT player took the field.
Think Sion* and Legia* against us in Europe.
Same should apply here.
Though I still don’t want the Trophies.

paulobhoy
6 years ago

The other thing is this ..
Many Scottish clubs missed out on titles, prize money etc
HOWEVER
the sweeping up my go beyond the SFA as could there be a bigger can of worms about to burst open ?

Think of the scale of prize money that the following clubs missed out on between 2000 and 2011 due to results against a ebt boosted rangers:
Kaunas (twice)
Herfolge boldclub
Monaco (missed dropping to uefa cup)
Maribor
Anzi
Dynamo moscow
PSG
FC Copenhagen
Maritimo
Famagusta
Artmedia
Porto
Molde
Maccabi
Livorno
Auxerre
Partisan
Bordeux
FK zeta
Red star belgrade
Stuttgart
Panathinaikos
Werder bremem
Sporting Lisbon (twice)
Fiorentina

paulobhoy
6 years ago

Wonder if these clubs are now aware of what has happened ??

jimbo
6 years ago
Reply to  paulobhoy

Maybe its time for us to inform them.
HH

The Silver Fhox
6 years ago

No point in asking UEFA or FIFA to get involved. They have been shown to be corrupt, which is why the SFA get away with being corrupt as well. Stinks of Establishment and Unionism.

Doc
6 years ago

The record books could look like this:
1939-1945 Void (due to huns)
2001-2009 Void (due to huns)

Andy
6 years ago
Reply to  Doc

Bahahahaha! Very good! How are we going to fix the engraving on the cups? If these other European clubs get involved the SFA will not want to set a precedence for taking off prize money etc. I can see the trophies and titles going, but the money is not going to happen.

andybhoy
6 years ago
Reply to  Doc

Good one Doc.

JoeMc
6 years ago

There are plenty of precedents in the sporting world for this type of thing. We’ve seen many times in the world of athletics that when an athlete is found to be cheating they are stripped of any medal earned and the athletes who finished below are promoted, medals awarded, etc.

I won’t get the feeling, emotion, joy of winning a title or cup because that’s been taken from me and my kind at the time. In one way I would like the redistribution to happen as it would probably allow us to bypass their much heralded total of titles, however I’d still take a bit of satisfaction in seeing their names struck-through on the trophies themselves.

Delighted to read about the growing momentum among the rest of the game, allow them to take the lead, some of these clubs have been wronged far more than us on an emotional level, teams who have won a handful of trophies in their history.

The shame of this will live on well past me hopefully.

BondiBrian
6 years ago

Personally ah don’t want Celtic to be awarded any cups/leagues.

Leave them null & void N let the huns try and explain that one.

On another note…nice to see Rogic getting better by the game.

Hail Hail N aw that.

tony_mac
6 years ago

I would never disagree that we are fully deserved of those titles, but we are in a constant pr war with these arse patches like jabba, swan, Jackson ect, for them to try to take anything away from the moment I see us do TIAR would leave a bitter taste in my mouth.

Like a fellow poster said on another post, leave them void, so future generations have to ask why?

And never let them forget.

jpm 88
6 years ago
Reply to  tony_mac

These msm guys you refer to will always try to denigrade anything we do or achieve anyway .
Why should we not have titles we won fairly and by the rules , for fear of what they may say ?
Believe me , having those stolen titles given back to us will hurt them a thousand times more than this ” having titles voided ” stuff .
And THAT’S a punishment they fully deserve.
New chant of “here we go 16 in a row ” should be sung every game now.
It will kill them to hear that !
Over to you GB.

Owenroe
6 years ago

Maybe the ‘bluenose’ or maybe it’s ‘red nose’, should invest in a packet of ‘dribble-pads’.Keep the Faith

tony_mac
6 years ago

Naw, its gonny be so much better to put them in their place in a few years when we wipe out their cheating 9 titles in a row, which no one seems to be talking about how they’re allowed to rack up 750 million worth of debt ffs, and the basterdised version of that ugly club are hopefully in the same league.
Then they canny say anything.
Then, as one of the best on screen villains ever, Bane, said to Batman, ” then I will allow you to die”.

BroxburnBhoy
6 years ago

Cheating is cheating and for sporting integrity the honors won cheating should be nullified and go to the runners up. Those are untainted those are rightly awarded to the teams who played by the rules. Nothing tainted about that. What is tainted is that they are held by proven cheats who gained a performance advantage through illegal payment schemes. Just like gold medals or yellow jerseys are awarded to clean and legal runners up so should the honors won by the Huns when they still existed. We should absolutely accept anything coming our way as a result. We played by the rules. So roll on reallocating these honors to clubs who played by the rules.

joe mccormack
6 years ago

All prize money paid to the cheats through the EBT years should be returned and reallocated to the other clubs, the victims.

It’s then a football debt covered, I believe, by that secret 5 way agreement.

Hey, but let’s not give them the 3 years that they have managed to delay the payment of the LNS fine!

As for SDM and the steelworks, is he taking the p*ss.

His previous stewardship of a group of companies ended in hundreds of millions of pounds of taxpayers funds being written off!

joe mccormack
6 years ago

Murray built his business on unsustainable debt thanks to his mates at HBOS and valuations on property and steel stock holdings that were off the radar.

There’s a big hole in the pension scheme, would he not be better addressing that before he rides to the rescue of what remains of the steel industry?

How does he plan to finance his scheme, has he a credit line from a bank?

If he has we demand to know, given his previous.

Strip the cheats of their titles now and strip SDM of his as well, only then can we move on.

The fans were clear in the message sent to their clubs when the attempt was made to shoehorn the new entity into the top league.

I think that an even stronger message is being sent this time. Non punishment is not an option and season ticket holders will ensure that their club’s do the right thing.

Bear in mind that what we know just now is the tip of the iceberg.

The EBT ‘ S, non payment of the LNS fine, King’s suspended sentence in South Africa, Rangers Euro licence……..all this will be nothing when the Craigster hits the play button on his tape recorder.

There will be a lot of very nervous people out there who would rather Mr Whyte and Mr Green would not be appearing in the witness box.

joe mccormack
6 years ago

The fake outrage in the media, the various individuals being quoted to give the party line, the mantra tgat there is no stomach for title stripping.

Are they joking, ask the fans, the people who count.

Stripping the titles and trophies is the least we expect from our club’s and football authorities.

The club’s know that if they ignore their fans wishes they are dead in the water.

The fans demand action, they demand justice.

You mad about ETims or just plain mad? Why not buy the t-shirt at http://etims.spreadshirt.co.uk/