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Celtic Diary Tuesday June 9: A Club Like Every Other

Celtic released information on what fans will get for their season book money when they renew, and to be perfectly frank, they don;t seem to have thought the problems through enough.

 

Taking the form of a Q and A , aimed at reducing the need to explain themselves publicly or over the phone to “customers “, it read;

 

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What they want is for everyone to renew, and hope that they’ll get into see a game at some point, which isn’t likely until at least Christmas.

In the meantime, your money gets you access to a live tv screening of home games, which doesn;t sound like value for money to even the most die hard of fans.

 

In fact, die hards often come from households with more than one book, and thats an awful lot of money to watch a game that will be on a stream somewhere or on the radio, which both serve as poor substitutes for the real thing, but beat watching the pages roll round on ceefax for uptdates.

 

Of course, that was years ago, and no doubt someone , somewhere has already decided to climb onto the stadium roof and set up a live You Tube feed, or some other ingenious way of getting to see the action, but what the club seems to have forgotten is that money for many is tight right now, and when the deferred rents/mortgages/other bills kick in again, it’s going to get even tighter.

 

Money for the football is going to be pretty way down the list for many, and the club seems to have put keeping themselves in their current financial position ahead of anything else, and that could be a major mistake.

 

Celtic fans are not as gullible as others, and will not fall for the line about keeping our club solvent when there’s a billionaire on the end of the phone who could transfer a few quid to keep things going.

 

It’s not like he wouldn’t get it back, with interest.

 

Celtic rely mainly on three sources of income to survive. sponsorship, player sales and season book money, television money is negligible, and there is a feeling that the tv company are taking advantage of the situation, using it to tie Scottish clubs into another piss poor deal for many years ahead.

 

It’s all a short term way of trying to deal with a long term problem, when a more sensible approach would be to work towards dealing with a worse case scenario, as opposed to hoping for the best .

 

There are no easy answers to all of this, but if the club are forced to sell assets , such as players, to make ends meet, then that has to be a better way of doing things than supporters having to sell their assets, such as houses.

 

It’s what businesses do when the cash isn’t coming in , and adjustments have to be made. What other businesses don’t do is ask customers to pay anyway, and then send them a video of their products to enjoy at their leisure.

 

The biggest fear for the board is that fans might not come back to football after all of this is done, when they realise what else they can get for their money as football takes a back seat, because lets face it, thirty quid or more for an hour and a halfs entertainment in the freezing cold isn’t going to seem so attractive when you’ve got out of the habit…

 

 

The board have taken what could be called a calculated gamble with supporter loyalty and passion. They have unashamedly played on the ten in a row campaign to shift books, and the problem is that although ten in a row , even behind closed doors, is ten in a row, but if no one is there to see it , did it really happen ?

 

 

Lawwell is asking us to insulate the club that has been a constant, the only constant, in our lives from hardship and possibly even meltdown, and many of us will.

 

Yet he, and the rest of his crew, have stood idly by when we were cheated during the last years of the Reich over at Ibrox.

 

Frankly, if he doesn’t give a toss about the clubs shareholders and supporters, why should we give a toss about him ?

 

 

What will be , will be, and we are heading into different and strange days.

 

The virus is still around, and infection rates are back on the increase. That means another, more serious lockdown is ahead of us.

 

Short term planning for long term problems doesn’t work, especially if the worst case scenario isn’t used as the basis for those plans.

 

Any business , especially one with a considerable financial cushion , that asks its customers to pay for a product they don’t receive is doomed to failure, and we may well have seen Lawwell’s Ratner moment….

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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alan Brown
3 years ago

I think it’s poor form from Celtic , at the very least they should be offering a reduction in Season ticket prices in my view.

Ricky
3 years ago

Agree this is short termism at its worst.Probably 80/90% will renew but some of the guys that wont just take it on the chin will be long term ticket holders.Of course they will be replaced by others desperate to see the 10 but realistically after 10 I reckon the numbers would drop off naturally anyway and that’s where the long timers would be missed ,the 35000 ish that would have stuck with it .Surely must have a rethink on this .Btw well done getting a piece up on this so quickly ,seems to be slipping under the radar on a couple of sites.

Man in Denial
3 years ago
Reply to  Ricky

10 is just a stop on the quest for 55 (the false target of Sevco The Rangers*). I don’t see why season tickets sales would drop off after next season.

After 55 -who knows ?

I’m optimistic, looking forward to next season (and if Celtic sell the right number of season tickets) to new signings who will improve our team. I was fortunate to have the money to renew so have done so. I appreciate that the global pandemic will cause fellow season ticket holders and supporters to weigh up how and if they can support the club financially next season. The point in the article about season ticket holders from the same household is a good one.

Next season might see The Rangers* throw everything at us without any care about their own finances. I want Celtic to be even stronger in the new season.

I hope all Celtic supporters find a way forward for next season.

HH

Millsy
3 years ago

Agree with much of the above!
The season ticket response from Celtic smacks of a lack of empathy from the Board – a well-heeled clique who take the supporters for granted – ‘A Board like any other ! ‘

Now is the perfect time for the men at the top of the club to show that THEY are supporters too ! THEY have vast resources among them – yet never appear to put their collective hands in their pockets – unlike the ordinary supporters .
What is their contribution at this unique time ? The supporters are being asked to continue to fund the club – what are THEY doing ?

por cierto
3 years ago

Re the Virtual Season Tickets. Just came to me that most clubs charge different prices for different areas of their ground, but, with this new Virtual Ticket everyone has the same view, so it doesnโ€™t seem right that any club can charge more to one fan than another for their Virtual Ticket, and thatโ€™s what most of them are doing, albeit for probably half a season. Any thoughts, por cierto?

Evilgenius9
3 years ago

Itโ€™s not great but under the circumstances Iโ€™d rather cough up and watch half the season on TV than see us have to cost cut and sell our top players. The club needs the ST money to pay the massive wage bill. There is no way around it. Iโ€™d rather pay it to see us have the best chance of winning the league this year possible. I know not everyone will agree.

If someone told me years ago we would have a chance at 10IR but the downside would be paying my ST to watch half the games on TV instead of at paradise, Iโ€™d have bitten their hand off for that.

3 years ago
Reply to  Evilgenius9

Of course, they could take this money in, and THEN sell the players…

Friesdorfer
3 years ago
Reply to  Evilgenius9

The club doesn’t need the money to maintain unsustainable salaries in the current situation. Reduce the costs (salaries) in accordance to the prevailing circumstances. There will be many, many supporters who will have to cope, so the players and Board should adjust similarly – if they wish for keep their already very well paid jobs. It’s not as if any of them will be on the breadline.

Evilgenius9
3 years ago
Reply to  Friesdorfer

I donโ€™t disagree and I wish football worked that way but we both know it doesnโ€™t. Most players wonโ€™t take a pay cut at any club. We are more likely to
let a few squad players leave or go on loan to cut some costs. Hayes leaving was a bit of surprise maybe less so Jozo but its started already.

Mike
3 years ago

A board like every other and a billionaire like no other.
I keep looking back to Celtic reaching the UEFA. cup final and yet we still lost ยฃ7.00 mill. Over the MON. years we lost a total off ยฃ50.00. mill. And who was it that paid off that ยฃ50.00 mill? It was the Celtic support, it is they that are the constant. “They are there, they are always there” said a legend.
Since then thanks to the Celtic support, the club has moved a long, long way. With a hefty sum in the bank and a playing squad coveted throughout Europe and worth many, many millions and to back them up are the men and woman whose blood flows green. It is they, who are the club. There is no doubt but that Celtic are by far the biggest and most successful club in Scotland, but will there be many other football clubs left to play in the SPFL? There are many ways to increase revenue, but I have no faith left in those who govern our game, especially after all that has happened in the past decade, none.

Edod
3 years ago

What happened to the business interruption insurance, did these supposed sharp businessmen not have the foresight (like other boards in Scotland) to secure this cover or were they just incompetent?

And, what about ยฃ30-40m in the bank, before asking fans to put there hands in to their pockets..dont we deserve some clarity as to why we are stock piling a rainy day fund while the storm lashes all of us.

As fans., this is our opportunity to get some real answers from a board that have been playing fast and loose with our emotions and finances for years.

It’s now time to withhold season ticket funds until we get answers on R12, the hotel etc…

Time for fan action not apathy or we are no better than our “brothers” in the Southside.

Reply to  Edod

Business interruption insurance was a brilliant idea , until someone made a claim against it . It appears the insurance industry never thought they would be an epidemic like covid 19 & hadnโ€™t it on the list that they would pay out . So there are no payouts . On the policie in the smallest of writing these type of viruses are excluded

3 years ago

Great article Ralph and having read the club’s Q&A’s last night which to be honest is no different from any other way they approach a statement I agree they are not only assuming the fans are stupid but believe it.

1 live stream per household?

This from the people who own Celtic TV which crashes when demand is too high.

What happened to the supposed deal with Sky which would enable all premiership clubs fans to see their clubs home matches? (Sky itself is another argument, like you I believe wrong TV company given deal plus perfect time if looking at reconstruction to get rid of split and playing teams 4 times a season).

As noted by you and multiple fans on twitter re. households with multiple season books people will be paying ridiculous sums to watch on a pc, laptop, tablet, etc. and why should households with multiple books pay same as those with 1 to watch on 1 stream? (Some households although tickets registered at 1 address not everyone may live there, my son stays at ex half the time so I will need to change his address to there).

If watching via stream, many fans will know from betting sites that there’s a goal in match around 2-3 minutes beforehand.

Celtic stating that they will look to offer incentives through season to fans but no indication what that is?

Celtic believing fans are so stupid by advising those who renewed in March that they will be in touch regarding revised T&C’s.
(Many fans will have signed up to same terms as last season yet Celtic seem to believe they can just replace those, (interesting legal stand there.))

You say a club like every other yet Motherwell appear to have put out a clear statement to their STH’s noting they won’t miss out:

“Weโ€™re pledging that everyone who buys a season ticket for 2020/21 will also get the full value of their purchase on physically attending games.

We guarantee everyone who purchases, or has already purchased, a season ticket for 2020/21 will get the chance to attend 19 home league matches, whenever that is possible.

If that is not possible in 2020/21, we will offer you the chance to claim the credit value of the missing games back. This can either be used against the value of your season ticket for 2021/22, or if you donโ€™t renew next year, you can claim the equivalent number of match tickets for games in 2021/22.

If matches are initially played behind closed doors, we pledge that you will not be adversely impacted.

For example, if five matches are played behind closed doors in 2020/21, you can choose to either have the value of those matches deducted from your season ticket cost for 2021/22, or we will give you the equivalent amount of match tickets for games in that season.

Everyone who buys a new season ticket will also be given free entry to our first UEFA Europa League match.”

I totally agree that if any supporter was questioning whether to apply for a refund for the missed 19/20 games the club have just blown away any goodwill they were hoping for.

SteveNaive
3 years ago

Never mind all that, whereโ€™s the caption ?
Only reason I come on here !

Cartvale88
3 years ago

The attitude towards a support that is always there is poor. The Q and A thought up by a five year old.
At the time of a major depression coming our way, the directors should be proactive, reducing the season tix price for season 20/21 and allowing those that want to watch a substandard product, no matter how u dress it up. THE option to pay game by game should be an option. I subscribed to Celtic TV till February of this year, and after five years gave up.
This is the season of ten in a row, but the continual downsizing, accepting the crap spewed by the Sevco creeps is unacceptable. As you said a club like no other, not in this present climate

3 years ago

What other businesses donโ€™t do is ask customers to pay anyway, and then send them a video of their products to enjoy at their leisure.

Bravo Ralph…great line there!

Can I just send a video of my ยฃ60 quid a month payment to Peter?..same principle Pedro!

I wonder why Celtic didnt say “We need your money. Hows about we ask everyone to pay the current lowest Season Book price for their category and see how it goes?”

There is a great thread on twitter highlighting how devious the Club was regards the (non) advertisement of Refund process..basically planking a vaguely titled tweet in amongst 44 other tweets they sent out that day…the next day the same accountg sent out a total of 1 tweet!

Of course folk arent paying for watching empty Telly games, they are paying for the opportunity to be in the stadium when the Ten is won, thats it..now if you ask Celtic fans “How much would you pay for that opportunity?” it would raise the sort of figures that would make Pedro weep with joy!

sfa unfit for purpose
3 years ago
Reply to  Desimond

I don’t understand why they are taking full payment for a seat that cannot be used ?
Also I imagine that Celtic tv will have anything from 1000 to maybe 10000 new customers for the run up to the 10.
Have they announced what Celtic tv will cost for next season.
The proper way to do this is charge for only the tv package until crowds are allowed back in , then adjust the cost to cover whatever games become available .

BroxburnBhoy
3 years ago
Reply to  Desimond

We can’t have it every way we like it, even if we want it that way. If its a business then get used to the club acting like a business. If its a Club like no other with a support like no other then maybe we can treat it less like buying a ticket on British Airways and more like what it mean to us. Im sure there are more common sense ways to balance paying for a season ticket to be present at the games with the fact that it seems we will be paying behind closed doors for a while. clearly there needs to be a reduction in cost and free subscription to Celtic TV. Even asking for a deposit and getting a free TV subscription could work then pay the rest of the season ticket at a reduced rate for when we can show up.

alzyerpal
3 years ago
Reply to  BroxburnBhoy

It’s the Board who want it both ways, and that’s exactly what they’re getting. If they want to treat it as a business, then so should we. Give them fuck all, until they are held accountable for res 12 and taught not to treat the supporters like gullible Huns. It’s OUR club, not theirs. Time to start bringing the Tory, Capitalist bastards to heel. This is the perfect time to start applying the pressure.

Paul Quinn
3 years ago

Why can this not be opened out to all supporters who would like to subscribe but are unable to be season book holders? Could games not be available at say ยฃ10 per game to non-season book holders and the money generated be used to reduce season book costs or refund season book holders for games they do not get to go to physically.

3 years ago
Reply to  Paul Quinn

Paul I was thinking along the same lines.
Buying a season book is to get you into the stadium and to take your seat and enjoy the match with your family and friends and listening to the guy behind you moaning about Jamesy again.
With no chance of that taking place this side of Christmas the season book should gave been shelved until such times as the supporters can get back into the stadium.
Now Celtic have a worldwide fan base the quest for 10 in a row would be the ideal selling point in a monthly subscription open to all. Why not give every household the chance to buy into it say for ยฃ200 a season. We have 60k season ticket holders probably 10k on a waiting list and plenty of others who would if they could buy into it. Some households have 3 or 4 season books and kids are cheaper. But if you open it up to all I’m sure the benefit to the club would far more outweigh the loss of season books just for a season? I think Peter has missed a trick.

Knightswoodbhoy
3 years ago
Reply to  Paul Quinn

Paul this cant be opened out because sky wonโ€™t let them they have a legally binding contract. They will control the number of log ins released, conversely in multiple season ticket households the game will be watched on numerous tablets ,phones and TVs limited only by the number of log ins

Mike
3 years ago

To lift your depression, eyes search over the river Clyde towards Govan.
Where a galaxy of stars are heading towards Ibrox in the year 2012. Reincarnation year. As the stars align from the past to celebrate 140 years of *Rangers history.
Looking forward to 150 years, where the special guest will be Alice in Wonderland as she joins with the rest of the “Mad Hatters” in sharing a tea party. Joining Alice will be Judas Iscariot. Oh look, there’s a squirrel, is she not pretty, pray, what do you call her? we call her Resolution 12. What is it she is carrying? oh that’s called a scythe. Res.12 cutting out the bullshit.

Andybhoy67
3 years ago

Surely the club can put a policy in place where families with multiple seats only need to pay one subscription but will still keep their physical seats for when normal service resumes.
Celtic can then sell this surplus of season tickets from these households to non season book holders but on the proviso that it will only ever be a virtual season book.
I know the T.V companies want to limit numbers but this would be a like for like in terms of paying customers with the only change being the admin required to secure the seats of the households with multiple season books.
They need to price it better too. People will make sacrifices to keep their seat. The club have to make some too.

Iancelt67
3 years ago
Reply to  Andybhoy67
Monti
3 years ago
Reply to  Andybhoy67

Surely Dermot Desmond could give the club next seasons ticket money, then say to the support they don’t have to pay a single penny.
Would that not be ” World class in everything we do “?
Not to mention a huge thank you to the support for years of backing?

If i had Dermots money, i would do it!

por cierto
3 years ago
Reply to  Monti

If Dermot had your money he’d probably do it as well :))

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  por cierto

If I met Dermot itld cost me a fortune to get drunk together.

Then next day sitting with his better half,ild be a waste of money using the use of his toaster.

Toast and ham spread.Hed learn to love it again.

Id send the bassa up to the shop for rolls and raw sugar.

Boo! They money men. Though good?

O`Yes.

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  portpower

Please believe,its their problem, not Celtics.

Humble directed the wrong way. sevconians everywhere.

sfa unfit for purpose
3 years ago
Reply to  Monti

you would be up to your eyes in bevvy and dirty dirty women after totally forgetting about the skint support…..
Just like Dermot

Monti
3 years ago

I don’t think so….

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  Monti

Unsurprising,I got knocked back afterall.

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  portpower

It`s a piece of paper.
Fergus to Dermot statue?

Entrepreneur game of marbles.

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  Monti

See,im tellin you right now Monti,itll be one of they right footers kickin the season off.

Ill even admit it it was the young Aussie boy Arzani that sent the scouts wanting all the same.
That turned out Two seasons of not realising,we
ve the same of our own.

If his attitude is right,id sign the fiert Scotchman,ยฃ3.25 million fee for David. Pedroll get it down to 1.1.

So much for dickie knees.

Damian Smyth
3 years ago
Reply to  Monti

Monti itโ€™s obvious why you donโ€™t have DD money & never will .
I know you are only joking but if D D did as you suggest this year . The amount of grief he would get from many fans the following year & subsequent yrs would be nothing ordinary

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  Monti

Monti,in his eyes hes short as well.Theyre their statute.We pay for dumbed down expected counter part-time of theirs.
I can understand those wanting shot of the lot. Born into it was a different message.
Any Rangers are the SFA.

Natural obedience worked once,lets try it again. Comfort.

What do you want,youre involved,arent youse!

Youse being a being mechanically in your own fantasy rote.

Every passing year,sevco need 2 bob.

The changing of rules shall be agreed.So!

A player wants to play.Thats what he`s there for to enjoy himself.

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  portpower

The shite is coming,not the sevco are coming.

Youre to love me,yourre to love me lots.

Relating to Scottish Premiership League, all CEOs shall be an example of our class, WASPs.

Round 67. Ding!

Fred Rodgers
3 years ago
Reply to  Andybhoy67

‘Were doing everything we can’, which means waiting on government guidelines, the same as every other club in the league.
‘We’re making progress’ which means treading water, awaiting government guidelines, the same as every other club in the league.
‘Additional value’ Christ knows what that means: I doubt the club even know themselves.
‘No refunds’ I do know what that means. It means I won’t be renewing seat 18 row DD section 415 Lisbon Lions for season 20/21. I may however renew seat 17 (my son’s) in order to view the games, along with my son in law, who also won’t be renewing, and anyone else who wants to share my telly on match days. Had we renewed when the first reminder came out (February or early March FFS!!!!!) we’d have paid ยฃ1212 between us. Now I can get the same thing for ยฃ219.
In my opinion Celtic have acted disgracefully throughout this renewal/refund phase. I wish I could say I was shocked by their treatment of the people who pay their wages and dividends but I’m not.

3 years ago
Reply to  Fred Rodgers

If there are to be supporters allowed into CP in a reduced capacity .I think the club should look at giving priority to households paying for multiple books to be the ones given tickets to attend .
I do not know how many supporters are in this situation but if there are ,say 15000 allowed into CP on a match day maybe it could cover most ,if not all of our supporters, who are affected in this way

Fred Rodgers
3 years ago

Someone did a calculation, based on social distancing,and the ground could only accommodate 1670 fans meaning that we’ve ‘virtually’ the square root of fuck all chance of attending a game this season.

Rob O'Keeffe
3 years ago

It just goes to show that so many Celtic supporters seem to be worried about paying for ST costing hundreds and even thousands in some households when a massive financial depression is forecast as a result of lockdowns due to the virus? Who are all these financially unaffected citizens who have no worries about everyday living? Or,are they showing signs similar to the Sooside Sectarians and being ever so slightly irrational in relation to future financial circumstances?…..

3 years ago
Reply to  Rob O'Keeffe

Rob everybody I spoke to is minted. Staying oot oor local has made them millionaires ๐Ÿ™‚

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  jimmybee

The state of us in the media few.

Let the pissed report on a Celtic FC cristinite undefeated season be
an occurrence live once again.

Bet we do.

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  jimmybee

Weve sold Fife,everyones getting a ticket this season.

Stesano
3 years ago

Your the last guy that should comment you give the club nothing!! You only use it to talk your total pish on here!

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  Stesano

CS does get you to think the opposite sides of the stem.

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  Stesano

X account.

Mike
3 years ago

If they are so desperate for money as they usually are, why did they not go for an additional year for Johnny Hayes contract and then sell him? We paid approx. ยฃ1.3 mill. for him, a player who still has so much to offer other clubs, that has a value, so why not sell him then?
Also Lawwell is always playing director of football, some of his PUNTS are PANTS. Lets face it Lenny has not got much say into what players we buy or sell judging by his comments. We thought that would happen and so it has. An accountant doing the player contracts is one thing, DOF is another, think of the money we could save if it was done correctly. We pay a lot for some players, but we let them go for SFA.

Mike
3 years ago
Reply to  Mike

So repeat after me: Peters Punts are Pants.

Devoy45
3 years ago
Reply to  Mike

Just thinkin ahead. 3/5/2
Forster
Elhamed/Jullien/Ajer
Forrest/Brown/McGregor/Taylor
Christie
Edouard/Griffiths
Must sign Forster!

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  Devoy45

Thinkinand a tinkerin
Adidas boots on the wrong feet for a while. Caught a yard or two out of pace.

Thats what you get for signing two too many right footers.

Gods southpaw,Jesus.

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  Mike

Put the Peter Lawwell bobbin in goals.

Is it true Pedro put the minutes into Stewart Robertson`s back pocket?

Aye Responsibility.

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  portpower

Non-finite umbrella of the SFA.

Same again in 2022.

Fred Rodgers
3 years ago
Reply to  Mike

Peter’s punts are pants !!!!

portpower
3 years ago
Reply to  Mike

Could have Jonny stood up for him self?
If so, i`ll shout him a drink.

At the Tic.

portpower
3 years ago

Relating to the points at which the luminous Green and White body would meet if produced backwards.They cunts.

The virtual niche.

Trust?

portpower
3 years ago

So whose a 9IAR XXL shirt?
See youse.Well we all do.
The back wheel of my Celtic scooter is not flat it has a puncture.

portpower
3 years ago

Piece of Work:
Alistair McCoist,what is plain as day is always covered.

Neither for luck or skill,you cheat.

portpower
3 years ago

Why was it all possible?

portpower
3 years ago

The SFA will enable altering in their placard similarities.

Help around activity.

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